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why no IS in primes ?
Am I correct that IS (image stabilization) is offered in zooms but not prime lenses ?If so, why ?

Comments (24)

D_G wrote:.

Am I correct that IS (image stabilization) is offered in zooms butnot prime lenses ?If so, why ? .

Nikon has a few VR prime lenses in the 200, 300, 400, 500, 600 mm range, but most prime lenses are simply older designs, before this was invented...

Comment #1

Canon has lots of fixed focal length lenses with IS, and Nikon has several VR lens near release. They have them in focal lengths of 200, 300, 400, 500, and 600 mm. In fact Nikon has a 100 mm f/2.8 macro VR..

Brian A...

Comment #2

I should have been more specific in my original post.First off, I am looking at Canon brand.Second, 35 to 100 length, not the long telephotos.Is there a reason for no IS at sub 100 lengths ? .

I understand one reason may be that IS is relatively new technology, and many of Canon's fixed focal length lenses are older productions models..

Specifically, I am considering to buy the 85 f/1.8 because it is considered a good indoor lens, suitable in for average light conditions.Wouldn't IS improve it's capabilities for hand held shooting ?

Comment #3

I use Minolta 7D DSLR with camera based IS. It saved many indoor images made with 24mm f/2.8, 50mm f/1.7 and 90mm f/2.8 primes..

You should add good external bounce flash with diffuser to your lens/camera set..

Http://www.stan-pustylnik.smugmug.com..

Comment #4

Only in these days of trying to out-spec the competitor are you seeing IS added to lenses that otherwise would NOT be crying out for them..

Perhaps someday can may add IS to the 100mm macro, but I can't see them really putting IS in any shorter focal length lenses..

Maybe if the marketers trump the engineers you could see an EF-S 50mm or 60mm IS lens, but I highly doubt that..

-gt..

Comment #5

Stan,.

I take some real estate photography and have never been able to get my flash (420EX with soft bounce), to give me acceptable results. Too harsh looking..

What has worked best for me so far is the 17-55 IS lens.. I am able to use that and get acceptable results by turning on the room lights, although not perfect because on several shots an orange tint appears. I assume that is because the room I is lit by traditional light bulbs, ceiling cans and table lamps..

My camera is 300D. The only "fast lens" I have is the 17-55 IS..

What would help ? a lens like the 85 f/1.2? photography studio type lighting with umbrellas? newer camera than the 300D ?

Comment #6

D_G wrote:.

Stan,.

I take some real estate photography and have never been able to getmy flash (420EX with soft bounce), to give me acceptable results. Tooharsh looking..

Doesn't RE photography just cry out for tripod use?.

I would think you could do some fabulous HDR photos with a good sturdy tripod, and probably MLU.

Warm regards,DOF..

Comment #7

As previous poster stated, tripod, camera timer and f8-f/16 for depth will do job for you. If you see reflecting surfaces - use Circular Polarizing filter to reduce it..

With tripod you will be able to use lowest ISO possible for best detail..

Estate photograpy for me sounds like wide angle. It these case prime wide angle lenses like 16mm, 20mm, 24mm will deliver best image quality in detail and color..

18-55mm is not so sharp, but at f/8 -f/16 should do decent shots..

Best light for indoor/estate is lighting that is in these rooms already..

Http://www.stan-pustylnik.smugmug.com..

Comment #8

D_G wrote:.

What is HDR ? .

High Dynamic RangeEither google it or search the forums for info..

It involves taking multiple bracketed photos and then combining them to eliminate shadows and highlights. Work really great to prevent blown-out windows and sliding doorsWarm regards,DOF..

Comment #9

D_G wrote:.

Stan,.

I take some real estate photography and have never been able to getmy flash (420EX with soft bounce), to give me acceptable results. Tooharsh looking..

Put the camera on a tripod - which you should be doing anyway - and learn to use Flash Exposure Compensation and you'll get spectacular results that don't even look like you used a flash. The 420 EX is perfectly capable - Just playing around with it and a 10-22 I've gotten great results in my living room with a 17' ceiling...

Comment #10

As the others responders have said, IS will only go so far; you need to use a tripod. It is an inexpensive and comprehensive solution to longer shutter speeds. IS will take you down to 1/8 s, perhaps even to 1/4 s, but there are always going to be situations where this will not be enough..

Flash is another solution, but you will probably need more than one 420ex to light some rooms. I have often used 3 flashes off the camera..

And why the aversion to zooms, the Canon 10-22 mm is an excellent lens..

Try selling this one:.

Image control:Zoom outZoom 100%Zoom inExpand AllOpen in new window.

Canon 5D with 24-105 mm @ 32 mm, f/4, 1/5 s, ISO 800 hand held with IS on..

I only had a couple of minutes to shoot this, but it would have been much better had I had time to use a tripod. I could have used a smaller aperture and lower ISO with a resulting better dynamic range..

Brian A...

Comment #11

I like your photograph..

Regarding the 10-22, I've got one and hardly ever use it. The walls, floors, furniture etc... get too distorted..

My 17-55 is wide enough for the compositions I want. Yes, it would be nice to occasionally get a little wider, but the distortion negates any benefit from the wider perspective...

Comment #12

D_G wrote:.

Regarding the 10-22, I've got one and hardly ever use it. The walls,floors, furniture etc... get too distorted.My 17-55 is wide enough for the compositions I want. Yes, it would benice to occasionally get a little wider, but the distortion negatesany benefit from the wider perspective..

The 10-22 mm exhibits very little distortion at 14 mm. With any ultra wide, the positioning of the camera is crucial  equidistant between the floor and the ceiling. There are potential perspective problems, but here shouldn't be barrel or pincushioning problems..

With either lens mounted on a tripod, you can shoot two shots, one for the room and one for the windows, and then merge the two shots. They are calling this HDR nowadays, but the practice has been taking place for a long time. If there are no windows, or if the windows do not provide enough light for a somewhat even illumination of he room, then shoot with the tungsten lights as the main light source; there are only problems colour balance when you have two competing light sources. If one dominates, then there isn't much of a problem..

Brian A...

Comment #13

Greentoe wrote:.

Only in these days of trying to out-spec the competitor are youseeing IS added to lenses that otherwise would NOT be crying out forthem..

Perhaps someday can may add IS to the 100mm macro, but I can't seethem really putting IS in any shorter focal length lenses..

Maybe if the marketers trump the engineers you could see an EF-S 50mmor 60mm IS lens, but I highly doubt that..

-gt.

A manufacturer offering something like image-stabilization on non-telephoto prime lenses is "trying to out-spec the competitor"? Having stabilization is still a benefit when using portrait-lengths, or wides... yes, you should use a tripod, but just because Canon doesn't see fit to do it (or won't make a lot of money on it) does not mean it's some sort of marketing gimmickry..

For example, Pentax and Sony have in-body stabilizing systems so that all lenses benefit - Pentax in particular makes compact prime lenses, including wide-angles, which take advantage of shake reduction in the camera. It helps in low light, regardless of focal length...

Comment #14

The forte of prime lenses is their speed and high IQ. Adding moving elements inside the lens to perform VR/IS reduces IQ. Fast lenses are larger in diameter, so the moving VR/IS elements would be bigger and heavier...making it difficult to move quickly. With short FL lenses, there is little benefit (other than perhaps a marketing ploy and bragging rights) to having VR/IS..

JChristian wrote:.

Greentoe wrote:.

Only in these days of trying to out-spec the competitor are youseeing IS added to lenses that otherwise would NOT be crying out forthem..

Perhaps someday can may add IS to the 100mm macro, but I can't seethem really putting IS in any shorter focal length lenses..

Maybe if the marketers trump the engineers you could see an EF-S 50mmor 60mm IS lens, but I highly doubt that..

-gt.

A manufacturer offering something like image-stabilization onnon-telephoto prime lenses is "trying to out-spec the competitor"?Having stabilization is still a benefit when using portrait-lengths,or wides... yes, you should use a tripod, but just because Canondoesn't see fit to do it (or won't make a lot of money on it) doesnot mean it's some sort of marketing gimmickry..

For example, Pentax and Sony have in-body stabilizing systems so thatall lenses benefit - Pentax in particular makes compact prime lenses,including wide-angles, which take advantage of shake reduction in thecamera. It helps in low light, regardless of focal length..

Charlie DavisNikon 5700 & Sony R1HomePage: http://www.1derful.infoBridge Blog: http://www.here-ugo.com/BridgeBlog/..

Comment #15

Hugowolf wrote:.

D_G wrote:.

Regarding the 10-22, I've got one and hardly ever use it. The walls,floors, furniture etc... get too distorted.My 17-55 is wide enough for the compositions I want. Yes, it would benice to occasionally get a little wider, but the distortion negatesany benefit from the wider perspective..

The 10-22 mm exhibits very little distortion at 14 mm. With any ultrawide, the positioning of the camera is crucial  equidistant betweenthe floor and the ceiling. There are potential perspective problems,but here shouldn't be barrel or pincushioning problems..

Yes, many people don't understand perspective distortion and often blame the lens. Nikon and I think Canon have PC lenses...Perspective Correction...where the lens can be shifted off axis. This helps, but they are expensive. With digital photography, the same thing can be done better and much cheaper with PP..

Another approach is to stitch several images taken with "normal" FL lenses together to get a wide view. Doing this inside will require a tripod and a "pano head" to insure the camera rotates around the entrance pupil. The result will have more resolution than one image taken with a WA lens. You can also combine panoramic stitching and HDR if you want a REALLY stunning pic..

Charlie DavisNikon 5700 & Sony R1HomePage: http://www.1derful.infoBridge Blog: http://www.here-ugo.com/BridgeBlog/..

Comment #16

D_G wrote:.

Regarding the 10-22, I've got one and hardly ever use it. The walls,floors, furniture etc... get too distorted..

You might try correcting the geometry using DxO Optics software. I swear by DxO. It does a lot more than just correct lens geometry, but that's it's most brilliant feature..

Http://www.dxo.com.

Dpreview & pbase supporterhttp://www.pbase.com/digirob..

Comment #17

For a good description of HDR and any other photographic term I suggest you first try WIKI.

Http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High_dynamic_range_imaging..

Comment #18

Chuxter wrote:.

The forte of prime lenses is their speed and high IQ. Adding movingelements inside the lens to perform VR/IS reduces IQ. Fast lenses arelarger in diameter, so the moving VR/IS elements would be bigger andheavier...making it difficult to move quickly. With short FL lenses,there is little benefit (other than perhaps a marketing ploy andbragging rights) to having VR/IS..

An interesting point, but I'd kill for a 100/2 IS. At least in that case, not just a marketing ploy. Maybe you didn't mean to include that as a "short FL lens" but in any case, it doesn't exist and I wish it did...

Comment #19

Ricari wrote:.

An interesting point, but I'd kill for a 100/2 IS. At least in thatcase, not just a marketing ploy. Maybe you didn't mean to includethat as a "short FL lens" but in any case, it doesn't exist and Iwish it did..

I've got a stabilized 100mm f/2 (stabilized by my camera bodies).  .

I shoot with a Konica MInolta Maxxum 5D and a recently acquired Sony DLSR-A700, both of which will use any Minolta Autofocus Lens..

Fast, stabilized primes are very nice to have in low light. Here's one I took recently while taking my wife out to dinner:.

Sony DSLR-A700, ISO 3200, Minolta 100mm f/2 Autofocus Lens at f/2.5, 1/20 second.

Image control:Zoom outZoom 100%Zoom inExpand AllOpen in new window.

JimChttp://www.pbase.com/jcockfield..

Comment #20

Tripods aren't allowed in museums..

Image control:Zoom outZoom 100%Zoom inExpand AllOpen in new window.

1/5s f/4.0 at 35.0mm iso1600.

Nor are they much use in a canoe..

Image control:Zoom outZoom 100%Zoom inExpand AllOpen in new window.

1/50s f/6.3 at 420.0mm iso400.

Nor for quick candids.

Image control:Zoom outZoom 100%Zoom inExpand AllOpen in new window.

1/13s f/1.4 at 85.0mm iso400.

Nor in crowded markets.

Image control:Zoom outZoom 100%Zoom inExpand AllOpen in new window.

1/50s f/5.6 at 200.0mm iso400.

Nor on the street.

Image control:Zoom outZoom 100%Zoom inExpand AllOpen in new window.

1/60s f/5.6 at 105.0mm iso320.

Nor for packing through tight spaces.

Image control:Zoom outZoom 100%Zoom inExpand AllOpen in new window.

In-body stabilization gives the photographer more flexibility in where one can set up, and in lens choice...

Comment #21

D_G wrote:.

I should have been more specific in my original post.First off, I am looking at Canon brand..

Then you missed the memo .

IS is useless in all lenses except those in which Canon offers IS..

Love the response that says IS in shorter lenses is simply trying to "outspec" the competition. Couldn't *possibly* be that people actually *want* IS with short lenses ... nah. Canon will tell you what you want..

Personally, I'm with you ... give me IS with lenses I'd handhold anyway, skip the IS on lenses I'd shoot from a tripod anyway. (IS with my 85/1.4 is pretty handy)..

I understand one reason may be that IS is relatively new technology,and many of Canon's fixed focal length lenses are older productionsmodels..

More like Canon never had to compete with in-body stabilization for market share..

Wouldn't IS improve it's capabilities for hand held shooting ? .

It would, but you're not supposed to wonder that  But don't worry. While Canon's white paper is reassuring you by telling you that in-lens IS is vastly superiour to in-body because it works better at long focal lengths, and you only need it with long focal lengths, they're quietly introducing shorter IS lenses ... all part of their ruthless kick the competitions collective butt strategy ... and all part of the reason why you can't really go wrong with Canon .

- DennisGallery at http://kingofthebeasts.smugmug.com..

Comment #22

Chuxter wrote:.

The forte of prime lenses is their speed and high IQ..

Right, I realize this..

Adding movingelements inside the lens to perform VR/IS reduces IQ. Fast lenses arelarger in diameter, so the moving VR/IS elements would be bigger andheavier...making it difficult to move quickly..

I'm not questioning the benefit of VR/IS on fast lenses...?!.

With short FL lenses,there is little benefit (other than perhaps a marketing ploy andbragging rights) to having VR/IS..

That is where we (and apparently others) disagree..

JChristian wrote:.

Greentoe wrote:.

Only in these days of trying to out-spec the competitor are youseeing IS added to lenses that otherwise would NOT be crying out forthem..

Perhaps someday can may add IS to the 100mm macro, but I can't seethem really putting IS in any shorter focal length lenses..

Maybe if the marketers trump the engineers you could see an EF-S 50mmor 60mm IS lens, but I highly doubt that..

-gt.

A manufacturer offering something like image-stabilization onnon-telephoto prime lenses is "trying to out-spec the competitor"?Having stabilization is still a benefit when using portrait-lengths,or wides... yes, you should use a tripod, but just because Canondoesn't see fit to do it (or won't make a lot of money on it) doesnot mean it's some sort of marketing gimmickry..

For example, Pentax and Sony have in-body stabilizing systems so thatall lenses benefit - Pentax in particular makes compact prime lenses,including wide-angles, which take advantage of shake reduction in thecamera. It helps in low light, regardless of focal length..

Charlie DavisNikon 5700 & Sony R1HomePage: http://www.1derful.infoBridge Blog: http://www.here-ugo.com/BridgeBlog/..

Comment #23

D_G wrote:.

Specifically, I am considering to buy the 85 f/1.8 because it isconsidered a good indoor lens, suitable in for average lightconditions.Wouldn't IS improve it's capabilities for hand held shooting ? .

IS might get an average person with an average portrait subject about one stop with this lens. By that I mean 1/160 is about the "safe" limit (I have found) with this lens to guarantee shots free of handshake. 1/80s would be about the limit for posed pictures where the subject doesn't move enough to blur the results. IS would be great for static subjects, but for a fast portrait lens like the 85/1.8, success is more often than not dependent on the subject. Now with a longer lens like the 135/2, it would help significantly (2 stop or so safer)....

CW..

Comment #24

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