I see a lot of " sent an email ", did you try and call Jelsoft/Vbulletin, thats what I would do if my site was shut down.
Ive never heard of these guys before...
I sent Jelsoft an email about this, haven't receive a reply but will call within 3 hours (just to give them some time to read my email) and awaiting my services to be restored.
Notice I receive the DMCA notification at 12:00 AM in the morning US Eastern Time. Talking about a wake up call?.
Anyway, I sent an email Jelsoft at about 8 AM in the morning Eastern time, just receive a reply at about 12PM Eastern time, 4 hrs later, here's the message.
[The problem was that you issued a dispute with Paypal on Feb. 23rd concerning this purchase and they charges it back. Then the dispute was removed on Mar. 2nd without telling us.
I have reinstated this license and will forward this to Pirate Reports so they can follow-up.
Customer Support Manager, vBulletin].
1St of all, they never apologized for cutting my service off..
2nd they never bothered to check the license.
3 they never bothered to email me, just hit the DMCA button and sent my forum into the oblivion.
4 they never bothered to contact my host to apologize to fix the problem even though I requested/demanded.
So now my problems wont be solve until the fat cow comes home.
All they say was "sending follow up" guess to who? to the screw up who never bothered to email me before permanently destroying my businesses. questioning my integrity without sending any warning, out of nowere, 12:AM in the morning, a DMCA.
How professional is that?.
FYI I purchased the license Feb 23/2009.
I did not instigate anything with paypal, paypal was verifying if my account have been hack, and sent Jelsoft a notice to asked if the purchase was valid. Both me and Jelsoft confirmed the purchase was valid, hence, there was no charge back or cases whatsover.
A month later, out of nowhere, a DMCA from some unfriend "good faith" pirate junky who works for Jelsolf/Vbulletin to say that I am using stolen goods etc.,.
To Jelsoft's reponse, I find this unprofessional. I wish I never have wasted money on Jelsoft/Vbulletin.
Anyway, the software is owned license, I bought the blog with it too. Dissapointed that they do not check anything, and the pirate junky is a slanderous lizard with no ethics whatsover. Should have contacted me before telling my host to shut down my business and slandering me as a person who stole Jelsoft property online.
Anyone wants to buy it off of me?.
Are there other legal recourse which I can take against this pirate junky in the meantime?.
Because Jelsoft has not send anything to my host yet, and my problem at this point is unresolve, my business forum is down for good..
Just as your dispute with paypal was a mistake so was their DMCA...seems like a wash.
Crap happens. Get it sorted out and move on. It's a mistake and it's not malicious in nature. I doubt you have any recourse here.
Piratereports.com is an agent of Jelsoft contracted to help them deal with pirates...
My forum was physically deleted.
I only have a fullback up, I don't have have the password to the whm to back it up. They should have at least gave me a warning of what's to come before filing it with my host to delete my forum.
I have having problems restoring the site. I do not have the homedirectory files, the fullbackup.tar file is corrupted. It looks like after 1 month and 2 weeks of advertising on Google adense spending hundreds, paying forum posters, now the forum is gone.
All my hard work and configuration gone. Hopefully the file is recoverable.
Not to mention that I paid people to configure and install for me. etc.,.
Over 1 month of work destroyed.
And they didn't even apologize or send my host a notice that the accusation is false at the moment of writing this.
I disagree that this is just a mistake.
The company accuses me of online property theft, violating international without checking it's documentations or whatever database that they held to verify the facts. As the email stated, they didn't know that the case was drop. There was no case, I made it clear in my other emails to them before march 2 that I was using it in conjunction with phprobid.
Their tech support said that they do not offer support for phpprobid, only vbulletin.
Now they come around saying that there's a paypal dispute that went away which they did not know of. Yead right, if there infact been a dispute, they should have revoke the license by sending my site down before 3/2. I purchased the license two weeks before that and have been running it, and notified them it was running.
How can they not know, and where is this Pirate Junky get his data from? that is unverified?.
Next time, if they should do this to their customers, at least send a notice and have the customer respond before persuing a DMCA and calling the customer a thief.
This is not a mistake, this is negligent on Jelsoft and it's Pirate Junky who did not verify data and made no attempt to contact owner of forum before filing and calling owner thief...
Either you, your bank/CC or PayPal is at fault here, not Vbul. Their charge was disputed, so naturally they killed your license...
[The problem was that you issued a dispute with Paypal on Feb. 23rd concerning this purchase and they charges it back. Then the dispute was removed on Mar. 2nd without telling us.
I have reinstated this license and will forward this to Pirate Reports so they can follow-up.].
Trying to blame me and paypal. That they Jelsoft did not know what was going on with the payments. Do you actually believe Jelsoft's response that they did not know what was going on?.
This is a case of negligent.
They never apologize to me for slandering my business and as a person.
They never apologize to my host, even though they send the email to my host requesting that my site forum be taken down and deleted.
Guess what? my forum was physically deleted. All my hardwork and configurations gone.
What do you think of their response?.
Should they at least apologize for mistake,.
Should they at least send an email to my host saying that their previous statement were false and that my site should be restored? they did not.
Did they even offer techicial support? even though, they screwed me over.
Their response say it all, even after 30 years in business. They haven't learn a thing.
It cost me over a grand to advertise, pay writers, and forum, configuration, and more than 1 month of work. No apology whatsover, not even a notice to my host saying "we made a mistake" please undo the changes.
As I am writting this, I had to send about 5 tickets to my host, had 5 live chat sessions and this is not even restored.
I am still waiting until the cows come home on this one.
Okay the cows finally comes home. The the site is now restore.
Finally after more than 12 hours of downtime and hours of countless tech supports and verifications......
I was not able to update my site and my paid users are wondering if I will be in business tomorrow. All thanks to negligent of the pirate junky and jelsoft and my host...
I have heard some horrible vBulletin stories, thanks for sharing. Maybe we can hope that people searching phrasese like vBulletin sucks will find this thread and be aware that one small clitch and they can litterally shut anyone down in the world.
What if you had your own dedicated server and were hosting hundreds or thousands of sites? It would all have been gone because of this, and everyone elses accounts too. I'm really sorry your host actually listened to that letter from vBulletin and Pirate Reports. I would find a new host if I were you.
I would be interested in what host shut you down if you care to share as I will never use them. I have used many shared and dedicated server companies out there and have learned you have to stay away from some of them.
I think that was the main problem and the scary part... a webhost listening to a letter like that and taking action without any due process. If vBulletin wanted to file legal charges against you, let them, but don't drag the host into it. The host CANNOT and SHOULD NOT make legal decisions. They need to get out of the way or they will find people will rise up and boycott...
Thanks MJ for your support, I think there's nothing I can do at the moment but to save my files and prepare to move host if necessary. And move on.
But then again, my hosting account is up in 5 months or 4 months. My site hasn't grown yet to the level I wanted it to grow. I believe my host now are much more "educated" before make stupid decisions like deleting a customer forum permanently without consulting or giving the customer a chance to provide evidence. As for the company in question, hopefully they will do a thorough check and email the owner before resorting to actions that will damage someone's business.
I have 2 accounts at that host for different domain names. I find that many resellers sell the same thing either from a few different companies to choose from.
I am considering moving my hosting. But haven't made up my mind as to "when" because I have to backup and prepare for the move etc.,.
Actually this post will not show up in search engine because the section "legal discussion" is only available to members as I believe. If you log out, you will not see this section at NP...
Site looks up and running fine now. Congrats. DMCA...that is the legal process.
Tech4 I think you need to seek a resolution instead placing blame all over the place. Realistically you should imho ask Jelsoft for 3 years free updates and support to partially make up for the days loss in both time and effort.
I suggest you speak to Jelsoft but with a better attitude about all this...
Thanks for the suggestion Labrocca,.
My attitude was to "wait yesterday". After 4 hours, I received their reply. "It was not us, it was you or paypal". NO apology, they should have at least apologize like:.
-"We are sorry it happened". We will take this into account for future services will check with customer first before sending a legal notice and initatiating claims.
-We will send an email to your host to amend for the wrong statments, your business is legitimate, you did not stole anything from us. etc.,.
After 30 years in BusinessNothing"It was you or paypal".
That was then my attitude about Jelsoft deteriorated.
What do you think Labroca? some of my paid users asked if my site will be up tomorrow. They think I am cooked, and asked if I will pay them...
Start a new blog about how horrible this experience has been, and don't forget to name those that wronged you, unless you plan on filing a suit...
Why did PayPal think your account was hacked in the first place.....
Infact any tech/credit companies now a day will check and ask for verifications on purchases that they believe are suspicious. The case is about negligent, however, Vbulletin claim 1) there was a dispute, 2) the dispute was drop, 3) they did not know that the dispute was drop.
I told Vbulletin I was using their software prior 2 weeks to 3/2/2009.
I had tech support tickets and they were answering them. So there was no dispute. If there were dispute, Vbulletin would say something, especially when I told them the site is used in conjunction with probid during one of my tech tickets. And my site was live, with the link on it during the tech supports...
Oh geez, let it go. It's back up and running. Besides, if this has been up for only 2 weeks and you are hosting it on GoDaddy, it can't be that big at all.
Seems like you are trying to find a way to go fishing for some $ compensation. Not gonna happen. For future reference, that info is turned over only to members of law enforcement and the court...
Switch to Mybb imho. VB sucks and realistically you're gonna keep paying them if you keep the license. Their yearly upgrade fee is complete bullshit.
Mybb is a free GNU/GPL project that's doing great things. http://www.mybboard.net.
My mybb support site: http://www.mybbcentral.com.
Switch to IPB even. Tell your users your experience with VB and move on asap. You're huffing and puffing a lot but that won't get you anywhere. VB most likely doesn't care and legal action is a dead end imho...
Thanks for the MyBB link.
I will look into this...
Its illegal for someone to file a DMCA take-down notice for someone else unless they have been hired as legal council. You can't just make an assumption that someone has pirated a script / software. http://www.youtube.com/view_play_lis...8288152F39B08E..
Not the first time this has happened. I seem to remember a case where someone at Pirate Reports didn't like the anime content that was on a site, and he tried to have it taken down as well...
Good video. Not sure if it's real though.
I heard of the anime case, any other cases?..
Paypal doesn't have to justify itself or provide any reason I didn't get that vibe at all... Seems like all he wanted was a "We're sorry", and yet he got none.
I think this goes far deeper than money. The fact that huge internet companies like vBulletin, Paypal, PirateReports, etc, can do anything they want to anybody. They can pull strings, have connections and control even you and me. They can make your life wonderful, or a living hell.
Time to stand up and fight for the little guy, when you realize the little guy could be you.
"Civilization can only revive when there shall come into being in a number of individuals a new tone of mind, independent of the prevalent one among the crowds, and in opposition to it a tone of mind which will gradually win influence over the collective one, and in the end determine it's character. Only an ethical movement can rescue us from barbarism, and the ethical comes into existence only in individuals." - Albert Schweitzer..
PirateReports.com has been vB's agent for years.
Reading your first post, it mentioned the url used in the license didn't match up with where they found the software installed, they didn't find your site connected to a license - therefore they thought it was pirated.
They don't owe you a sorry, really. You appeared to be violating their license, etc; they took action. They probably should have done things differently, as far as maybe contacting you first instead of having the host shut down the site, but what happened... happened.
Like it or not, you can disagree with it 'til you're blue in the face, but having a valid URL listed is part of the license requirements; and that same license gives them the right to terminate the license at any time. That license is displayed each and every time you download vBulletin...
Eric you say they do not owe me an apology. Are you sure. Please read carefully.
They initated A legal process, to make a claim that I stole their property and to my host to delete my forum without checking the facts or even checking in with me.
After I complaint they did not go back to my host and say they withdraw their false statement or offer an apology. If I were to say "Eric is an online thief who stole Namepros, Jelsoft, and Yahoo's content, please shut down his business, delete his sites" as I believe in "good faith" and honor, Eric is using stolen property.
And then I find out what I said was false. Do I owe you Eric an apology?, according to Eric I owe him nothing. Isn't that right Eric? Even though I call you a thief etc, had your site deleted/shut down.
I would say, well Eric, you appear to have an invalid URL therefore, let's "face it until you're blue in the face." Having a valid URL listed is part of the license requirements; and that same license gives me the right to terminate the license at any time.
Eric, do you have an live business that were forced to be shut down and deleted? I am sure you work very hard right? And so if someone deletes your work, call you a thief, etc., they do not owe you anything?.
Let's say I had a court order and so I went to court and forced your host or company to Shut Down Yoursite.com. Not only it's shut down, contents were deleted because I ordered so. I am sure you work hard on Yoursite.com? You're not upset at all? If I made false claims? again, I need not check my facts, because according to Eric I owe Eric no apology. Is that right Eric?..
So all you want is for them to tell you they are sorry?..
I don't want anything from them at this point. This is "Day 3".
I thought everything was back up and running again. Is it not?..
But isn't it a fact you said you had the wrong url? A company rarely gives apologies because that's an admitance of wrongdoing. It can be used in a courtroom to prove it and then assign damages.
They aren't sorry. They did what their policy required and you didn't follow the procedures of their license by providing a proper URL. If you have a grievance with anyone it's your host. They handled the DMCA wrong. You are suppose to be notified and given a certain timeframe to respond. At least I believe that's how it's worded.
1. Keep a backup.
2. Follow lesson 1 all the time..
Labrocca, the License is assigned to the domain name.
It is required when buying the Vbulletin. That's the first thing, it will not let you download unless you assign a URL to it.
So that was not my fault.
The company claim that they took the license away because of a dispute.
But they did not reinstate the license according to their email, it was due to not knowing that the dispute went away according to Jelsoft. The fact is, 1) there was no dispute as I said it before.
Because during the two weeks I was in contact with Vbulletin, and had my site up, with their forums. They knew that. If the dispute was then, they would responded via tickets, saying, "tech4, the software is in dispute, you do not want to pay for it therefore we cannot provide support, please take Vbulletin off your site".
The fact was, there was NO dispute, everything was fine.
Jelsoft made up an excuse to cover their lame ass.
At the moment. I could careless if they are sorry.
Labrocca where did I say that I have the wrong URL?.
....jelsoft made an excuse to defend their pirate junky....that excuse have no merit, like their pirate junky who claims "good faith" to have 0 merit whatsover.
"Not knowing the dispute was drop", and "good faith" no merit, zero credibility=negligent as I described earlier.
They have been in business for 30 years, and their response sickens me.
It wasn't us, it was you or paypal. heck their response is even funny.
Jelsoft did not know that the dispute was drop....Please everyone...if you believe the statement...you might as well believe that alien exists...
Currently, I am trying to market the site as much as possible. I am focusing on growth.
I am also looking at a reliable host to switch to.
Add moderators to the forum.
Create ad campaigns.
And then finally move on to another forum software (which might take a while).
That's the plan. Just moving along...