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Help w. Lightroom and Elements
Hey guys. So I'm delving into the PP world and decided to demo out Lightroom in conjunction w. Elements and I'm having issues. I used to use Picasa as my PP tool so that's my ref..

I finally get everything all organized in Lightroom (which doesn't auto refresh folders like Picasa) and decide I want to edit one of my photos. (Panny FZ8 cam. shoot in hi-res JPG). I dabble around with it and can't find a "Save changes" like in Picasa but that's fine, I want to mess w. selective coloring. I right click and choose "Edit in Elements".

LR adjustments and do my thing in elements. When I save, the saves aren't made to the LR file and I have a NEW file that I now have to import into LR. What gives?.

Finally, when I'm done w. LR, then elements, and I finish w. a crop in LR, how do I get my final product in windows explorer? Export? Full-sized JPEG option?.

Sorry for the noob questions but I'm definitely a little lost. Played with this issue for 3 hours last nite. Basically, I'd like to keep the files to a minimum. I'd love for all my changes (whether in LR or Elements) to be all on one file, then once I export/save, I have two files (original and modified), like Picasa. It just makes sense in my head. Does it not work like this? Thanks!..

Comments (5)

LR doesn't compare well with "editors". It's a strange (but wonderful) organizer, with some editing capabilities..

1st, LR doesn't normally change the source file. That's a GOOD thing, plus it makes it fast. All the changes you make via LR are NOT written to the source image file, but rather saved in a "sidecar" file. When you are through with LR, you must "export" a 2nd file that incorporates all the changes. You are allowed to name this object file in any way desired. You can also choose to launch PSE and have the new file(s) appear there for more advanced editing.

You CAN use the same file name as was exported from LR. This is OK especially if you retained an untouched original in the bottom layer, with all PSE edits in the higher layers. This edited file should be saved as a .PSD, so that layers are retained. It can also be saved as a separate JPEG file...your choice..

Jazzman161 wrote:.

Hey guys. So I'm delving into the PP world and decided to demo outLightroom in conjunction w. Elements and I'm having issues. I used touse Picasa as my PP tool so that's my ref..

I finally get everything all organized in Lightroom (which doesn'tauto refresh folders like Picasa) and decide I want to edit one of myphotos. (Panny FZ8 cam. shoot in hi-res JPG). I dabble around with itand can't find a "Save changes" like in Picasa but that's fine, Iwant to mess w. selective coloring. I right click and choose "Edit inElements".

LR adjustments and do mything in elements. When I save, the saves aren't made to the LR fileand I have a NEW file that I now have to import into LR. What gives?.

Finally, when I'm done w. LR, then elements, and I finish w. a cropin LR, how do I get my final product in windows explorer? Export?Full-sized JPEG option?.

Sorry for the noob questions but I'm definitely a little lost. Playedwith this issue for 3 hours last nite. Basically, I'd like to keepthe files to a minimum. I'd love for all my changes (whether in LR orElements) to be all on one file, then once I export/save, I have twofiles (original and modified), like Picasa. It just makes sense in myhead. Does it not work like this? Thanks!.

Charlie DavisNikon 5700, Sony R1, Nikon D300HomePage: http://www.1derful.infoBridge Blog: http://www.here-ugo.com/BridgeBlog/'Experience: Discovering that a claw hammer will bend nails.Epiphany: Discovering that a claw hammer is two tools...'..

Comment #1

Jazzman161 wrote:[snip].

Chuxter has already answered most of your questions, but here is some additional information..

If you want to keep two sets of edits in LR, e.g. one in B&W and one in colour, go into the Photo menu and click on "Create Virtual Copy". This will now create a second set of LR edits and a second thumbnail that you can start working on, but the original file isn't changed..

When you choose "Edit in Elements" LR creates a PSD file in the LR database and opens PSE and loads the PSD file. If, when you have finished editing in PSE, you save the file with the same name, it will overwrite the existing file which is already in the LR database. If you save under a different name, you will have to import the new file into the LR database and you will now have two PSD files - the one that was original loaded into PSE and a second with the PSE changes. It is therefore best not to change the PSD file name..

Finally, when I'm done w. LR, then elements, and I finish w. a cropin LR, how do I get my final product in windows explorer? Export?Full-sized JPEG option?.

Well, the first question is why do you want a file in Windows Explorer? The whole point of LR is that you can do almost everything in LR, including printing. If you want to, say, e-mail the file, then you will need to Export it from LR in the format that you want for e-mail, e.g. 1024x768 medium compression JPEG. You can set up an export pre-set for this..

Personally I try to keep all of my files in LR. If I need some JPEG files to burn to a CD for somebody or to e-mail them, I delete the JPEGs after I have used them because I can always re-export them again out of LR if I need to..

Chris R..

Comment #2

Things are as daft as they seem. The way Lightroom works is a little different than how most people think of doing things..

You have to start of with the realization that LR is a workflow program intended to manage lots of images, usually RAW files at that. LR doesn't really edit any files. (Not 100% sure how JPG's are handled, but I'm pretty sure it's the same.) Edits are stored in the database and either in the RAW file itself (DNG) or with sidecar files. That's the beauty of LR. You never actually change your original image..

Jazzman161 wrote:.

I finally get everything all organized in Lightroom (which doesn'tauto refresh folders like Picasa) and decide I want to edit one of myphotos. (Panny FZ8 cam. shoot in hi-res JPG). I dabble around with itand can't find a "Save changes" like in Picasa but that's fine,.

Changes are stored on the fly. And you can (usually) undo them pretty easily since, as I stated above, you haven't actually changed the original, just made adjustments to it..

I want to mess w. selective coloring. I right click and choose "Edit inElements". Now I choose the edit a copy w. LR adjustments and do mything in elements..

So what happens is LR exports a copy with any adjustments you've made in LR. This is truly a different file than your original because the adjustments have "been applied" and exported..

When I save, the saves aren't made to the LR fileand I have a NEW file that I now have to import into LR. What gives?.

See the above statement. If it did save the changes made in Elements as well as the applied adjustments back to the file you have in LR, then you just lost your original file. A serious mistake in a proper workflow. The original is inviolate..

And, since LR doesn't know your intended use of the newly created file, it doesn't automatically import it into LR. That's your choice if this new file is meant to be kept or was a one off for a specific use..

Finally, when I'm done w. LR, then elements, and I finish w. a cropin LR, how do I get my final product in windows explorer? Export?Full-sized JPEG option?.

Cropping in LR is a bit hard to understand at first. The crop tool doesn't do away with any information, just hides it. This all ties back into the no changes to the original philosophy. So yes, you need to export a new cropped file for other uses. (resized for web & email, full res for printing, etc.) Printing and web site creation can be done directly from LR, but you may need discreet files for existing sites or printing at a lab..

Sorry for the noob questions but I'm definitely a little lost. Playedwith this issue for 3 hours last nite. Basically, I'd like to keepthe files to a minimum. I'd love for all my changes (whether in LR orElements) to be all on one file, then once I export/save, I have twofiles (original and modified), like Picasa. It just makes sense in myhead. Does it not work like this? Thanks!.

Not so much lost as confused when confronted with a new way of thinking. Three hours isn't much on the learning curve of not one but two new pieces of software..

Generally speaking, anymore I have two files (not counting backups) of the really good images. Very few actually get edited in Photoshop anymore, but when they need it I export an uncropped PSD file (I'm coming from RAW so work in 16bit color for the most part) and do my edits. All layers are maintained so I can come back later on if I need to further edit something. That gets imported into LR for management and crops and reductions are made as needed..

Also, those crops and reductions for web use and sending out for prints are, in my opinion, temporary files as they can be regenerated from LR at any time..

Another nice thing you can do with the two versions you have in LR is to stack them with the edited version on top. You still have both files, but the original is hidden and reserved for only when you need it..

Hope this helps.Chefziggyhttp://www.pbase.com/chefziggy/lecream..

Comment #3

Thanks for all the help! I'll look into the stacking and virtual copies..

I went through my edits again today and things went more smoothly. However, I have another question..

I now have the original file (well "original" as it has all the non destructive edits) and a tiff file from when I moved it over into PSE. I can't undo all my PSE's changes in the tiff to get it back to the original correct? All I can do is regress any ADDITIONAL LR changes on the tiff, right?.

Lastly, if I wanted to "undo" say 3-4 edits in LR, do I just click 4 steps back in the History? Because if I ctrl-z, it'll undo ANYTHING that's been done, including reorganizing or anything. I just want to go back in edits on my photo. Hope that makes sense?.

Thanks for the help all!..

Comment #4

Jazzman161 wrote:.

Thanks for all the help! I'll look into the stacking and virtual copies..

I went through my edits again today and things went more smoothly.However, I have another question..

I now have the original file (well "original" as it has all the nondestructive edits) and a tiff file from when I moved it over intoPSE. I can't undo all my PSE's changes in the tiff to get it back tothe original correct? All I can do is regress any ADDITIONAL LRchanges on the tiff, right?.

Well, if I understand your question and flow correctly, then you are right, you cannot edit and save the tiff in PSE, then undo those PSE edits in Lightroom..

Lastly, if I wanted to "undo" say 3-4 edits in LR, do I just click 4steps back in the History? Because if I ctrl-z, it'll undo ANYTHINGthat's been done, including reorganizing or anything. I just want togo back in edits on my photo. Hope that makes sense?.

Correct. You can also create a history snapshot of different settings and save those snapshots and select them at any time. However, snapshots do not keep each individual step of the history. Try it with some bogus edits and you'll see what I mean..

Thanks for the help all!.

Albert-OPlease visit me athttp://www.berto.zenfolio.com.

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Comment #5

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This question was taken from a support group/message board and re-posted here so others can learn from it.

 

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