Well I am divorced, unfortunately domains didn't exist then.
But from what I understand (in Canada) and watching what my.
Well established sister is going through with hers at the moment....
Some of this might help or maybe help figure out something else.
Were you into domaining before the marriage?.
I guess the first question is: How much of the joint money did you use?.
Or was it your own funds, that did not affect the household funds?.
Also, when sales or revenue were generated...where did that money go?.
Was this considered your job? By him?.
Or a hobby that made a few extra dollars?.
There are alot of questions that need to be considered, if you can find.
Out the laws in your area regarding "hobbies and extra cash" depending on how it was regarded in the relationship - will determine the course to go.
If it was considered a "job" by both and he wants to claim half then he needs to prove his half of the involvement.
(ie: renewal costs, transfer fees, paypal fees, taxes etc).
But then you get to claim half of everything he has ever collected as well....
It could get quite nitty gritty, but then that might make him back off about it.
I can't offer legal advice but hopefully these suggestions might give you another avenue to go down.
Appraising an entire portfolio can be quite the challenge, but you can just quickly conservatively estimate it if need be.
So you could under appraise - I mean, conservatively appraise, your portfolio, and if he complains you can then tell him to buy half of the portfolio at $50k. my gut tells me though that if he didn't pay in the registrations, made any decisions in which domains to invest in, and really doesn't have anything to do with the domains, you should be able to keep them.
Hopefully your lawyer can help you out with this, because I would imagine that the portfolio means more than just it's monetary value to you.
Good luck with the divorce...
We were married in 1991 and I started domaining in 2000. The money came from joint accounts. I have kept excellent records in a spreadsheet since 2001, so I know almost exactly how much the domains have cost: through today, it's right about $18,700. Although I have been a "domestic diva" since 1993, the cost of my domaining did not cause financial hardship, and my husband considered it my hobby. (We used to joke that his job was to make the money and my job was to spend it.) Sales and revenues either went into paying renewal fees or back into our joint accounts...
Well since you can't speculate the value - as everyone's.
Dollar amount would be different depending on the name they wanted.
I would take the $18,700 less what went back in, less the renewal fees.
And take it from there. At least you have documents to "show" the value.
At present. Cause if you don't sell them - there can't be a value.
But that's only if you actually have to include them or not..
I don't think a "hobby" is considered a joint asset. This would be.
The more likely route to go...
Obviously this is an asset and should be included in the marital assets. If you feel the value he has put on it is too high then I would suggest like your friend said about him getting the domains...
Domains are property. I'm no lawyer, but I'd guess if the registration money came from a joint account, you will either have to pay your husband half of the appraised value as part of the settlement or sell the collection and split the money. If it were me, I'd try to make an agreement to sell them and split the money. If the court forces you to get a paid appraisal, you will be royally screwed. Appraisals are expensive and generally inaccurate.
You could be mean and just fudge the whois on the best half and liquidate the crappy ones...
Is it too late to form an LLC and transfer them all over to the company? I guess at this stage, that would be considered hiding assets. Forming an LLC is definitely something people should consider if they ever amass a sizable chunk of valuable domains, you know, while the marriage is still good This is a tough one, but I think they definitely are considered property. I dont know enough about divorce law to understand how this works, but I'd imagine if they were acquired during the marriage using joint money, then they would be considered communal property.
As for value. If your husband doesn't know that much about domaining, is he aware of the value of PR and backlinks and stuff like that? If not, I wouldn't bring it up I agree with what others have said. If he feels that they are worth $100,000, you can argue against this but then offer to sell him the domains for $50,000 as part of the proceedings...
Appraising a whole portfolio can be a challenge..
Provided that you and your STBX agree you could come up with some alternate arrangement to split the portfolio in a fair way. One would be the lottery way..
Put all the names into an Excel sheet, sort them in random order and split the list in two, blindly.
Other possibility: put the portfolio on sale, and sell as a whole or each domain separately. Split the proceeds from each sale 50/50 until portfolio is sold...
All very thoughtful and useful input ~ Much appreciated!.
I think I'll do some combination of things to sort this out. Definitely sell off the "crappy" domains.
I purchased a number of domains after I signed the divorce papers, so I'm going to argue that those are my separate property and will not be considered in the settlement. He is presenting a similar argument on an asset he has, so he should be willing to accept this. We've agreed to settle out of court no matter what, so this can all be legally binding by including it in our settlement agreement.
Again, thanks to everyone for your posts. I've got some ideas now as to how to settle this issue in a way that's agreeable to both of us...
A logical approach would be to get an independent appraisal for the p[ortfolio from a 3rd party that is acceptable to both. split the cost for the appraisal, and take it from there..
Without getting into it too much as no one knows who might be reading this thread, I would 'suggest' a 3rd party appraisal company that tends to under value portfolios for your sake..
A second aproach, is to actually get an 'offer' from a 'third party' for the entire portfolio..
(I hope you get 'my drift' here in the quotes)..
Then, divide that offer in half, or 'sell' it at that price with a certain 'arrangement' to 'possibly' get the portfolio back as an option at a later date for a certain minimal 'fee'..
A good start might be digipawn.com, a domain pawn shop that will 'appraise' accordingly...
Hope this helps...
Well here is an idea, why dont you give all your domains as a gift to a friend or your relatives..
Than the value of them will be only the reg fee..
Or just go to date with a millionare domainer here.....
Glad to hear that the information helped a little..
Some good advice for sure..
I hope it all goes smoothly for you, divorce is.
Hard enough without the bickering over material.
Things. Take care and give us an update when it's.
All over if you can...
Domains are NOT property. Don't let anyone tell you otherwise. The courts have NOT ruled on this. If I was you I would fight to pay him the other half of the money you paid so they are your assets in full. Domains are rented from a registrar....they themselves hold NO value as property. This is why domainers should fight to keep it that way. Next we will be taxed on them!.
If I was you...get a strong lawyer which is the real key to any divorce. If need be...sell all the domains to a guy like me for a rock-bottom price. Maybe in the near future I will sell them back to you at a small profit.
Once the domains are no longer registered in your name he can't do jack. I will PM you now...
In reference to the above post by labrocca, here is an interesting article with comments on that very subject: http://www.circleid.com/posts/is_a_d...name_property/..
I'm sorry to hear about your divorce with your husband. I would like to start by saying I hope this gets resolved as quickly, painless, and with the least mess possible. (Although I know all divorce is messy).
Domains and divorce is an interesting concept. If he helped pay for them as mentioned above, I would just suggest paying him back what he paid and keep the names. This is my personal thoughts on this because names you pick up I feel he is not entitled to in anyway except for the fact he helped you pay. If that is not possible, try looking for quotes on your portfolio if you're really truley looking to sell. But what I would do before I took any action is consult your lawyer first. Find out if your domains are considered "marital assets.".
I am no law professional however, this is where I would find the argument: All names are registered under your name. (this I am assuming) Say for all 500+ names you have a current website at each. Is he entitled to the gross revenue of that name eventhough he has nothing to do with it other than maybe $8? Again, I am no lawyer, but it'd be an interesting thing to find out if it is considered a marital asset and if so, why.
Come on! You haven't worked outside of the home since 1993 and you are entitled to half the assets you and your husband have aquired since you have been married (and maybe alimony and child support too). If you own a house, cars, and other items you will get half the equity of those valuable properties that his hard work and occupational skills paid for. If you earned some profit from your skills in domaining since 2000 he is entitled to his half. Fair is fair!..
She said she was a "domestic diva" since 1993. I am a stay-at-home Dad since 2003. I have worked on oil rigs, on large and small fishing vessels, and at UPS. This is (by far) the toughest job I've ever had... don't get me started.
If she doesn't have kids, I take it all back...
Indeed, I've yet to find any Court ruling anywhere saying domain names are.
Property. The judge/s in the last sex.com decision would've said it outright if.
They found cause for such, though let's not argue the legalities of it since not.
One of us are lawyers anyway.
I'm seriously intrigued with pdcom's question, though at the same time I hope.
She and her STBX will settle that at the soonest possible time. Best wishes to.
Stick around, folks. We're all learning something good here...
I have sent ICANN and email to help to clear this up. Linking to this thread.
Btw.... what's up with 'appraisals' if you've paid 18K over the years ... that's what they're worth .. you have no way of predicting value based on wether or not any might be sold in the future or for how much.
Which will sell? for how much? which will you let expire? bet you the registrant of these domains can't even answer that...
Yes, when I was a career woman, I felt that way about stay-at-home parents. However, reality hit when I became one myself. I have 2 boys, ages 6 and 15. When our first child was a year old, my STBX and I decided it was better for me to stay home. STBX traveled extensively and we didn't need two incomes. I started a graphic design firm from my basement, which I ran for 2 years before we moved out of state.
STBX was able to advance his career and become so successful in part because of my willingness to focus on the home and family. He worked/works long hours and travels a great deal. One example: when our second child was still a newborn, STBX had to "move" to Seattle (we were living in Nashville at the time) for 4 months.
Throughout our 15+ year marriage, I handled the finances (including all manner of investments), home upkeep, children's activities, household shopping, cooking, cleaning... absolutely everything except for mowing the lawn and similar home maintenance. I supported him all along the way, patiently listening to his career challenges and offering advice and insight, and agreeing to move to different cities in different states when it was beneficial to advancing his career, even though it meant I had to stop going to college, close my business, or move where I had no family or friends. I also did a lot to increase our net worth through my investment and debt-management strategies. The way I see it, I'mwithout a doubt*fully entitled* to share in the profits of our marriage.
I'm very reluctant to divvy up my domain portfolio for three main reasons:.
(1) The money spent on the domains was also MY money.
(2) The domains I purchased were/are wholly from my own efforts. STBX had no input whatsoever. He could not have cared less. In fact, he nagged me for years about how much time and money I was "wasting" on the endeavor. He only recently developed an interest in my domaining when his IT guy got excited about my portfolio's potential.
(3) It's still up in the air as to how one would place a dollar value on an entire portfolio when it's not actually being sold. (Although I may end up doing just that.).
Keep in mind that although I'll get half the assets, spousal maintenance, and child support, those are temporary sources of income; my long-term financial security is being pulled out from under my feet. Having been out of the working world for 14 years, and still wanting to be at home for my children, I'm having to scramble to put together a plan for my financial independence. (Not to worry, though. I'm building a helluva good plan!)..
Pdcom: in reality, it was joint monies. He can't say all the money he earned is his. As far as the domain portfolio, unless it is help by a 3rd party (corp, LLC), then they are community property. I do feel for you in this circumstnace because I was in the same boat. To me, the value is registration costs, period (unless you have developed sites, then thats a different story). If you tracked expenses and income, you may be able to establish actual value of "the business".
Divorce is sad to begin with, but the laws are very clear on property and trying to skirt those is never a good thing...
Well with that history of supporting his career and whatnot, you'd probably be entitled to a great amount of the assets and probably some nice alimony if it went to court. I don't know the agreement you guys are working out, so maybe it's a fair division and I'm sure it's always better to handle things peacefully without the involvement of the courts, but thats always a card you have to play if things become unreasonable A guy claiming he brought in all the income in a marriage so he should get everything really doesn't go too far in court, especially not when the woman has left her career to raise kids, uprooted her life, business and education to support his career and handled investments and stuff Obviously you gave up a nice portion of your life to allow him to better his position in an effort to build a solid life and family together. Once that mutual life ends, you need to be compensated for that time and the opportunities you passed up.
My wife is the same way, she doesn't support me at all in domaining, but as soon as I make a sale, she's the first one with her hand out True, we do need the money to pay bills and stuff, so it's not like she just wants to go spend it, but it kind of makes it hard to grow my domaining business when I cant reinvest the profits. If I ever start making decent money, I'm investing in an LLC though I've spent 26 years trying to overcome poverty, if I ever get out, I'm not going back for anyone!..
Yes, I sure wish I had moved on setting up an LLC. I had looked into it a year and a half ago, but just didn't do it. I can't do anything about it now because it would probably be considered hiding assets, and I sure don't want to get slammed with that. Anyone reading this thread who has a reasonably valuable domain portfolio should jump on setting up an LLC or corporation. It's not very costly or time consuming and it could save you from a mess later on.
I think I'll post my portfolio in the Appraisals forum later today. I would really appreciate anyone checking it out and giving me some ideas on what the whole portfolio might be worth. I don't know how much weight that will have on the situation, but it couldn't hurt.
I'll post the link here when I open the thread in Appraisals.
Thanks, everyone, for chiming in!..
If you had a very trust worthy friend, place a Ebay sale with all the domains at reg fee. Put a buy it now at the cost to reg all the names in the auction.
Have your friend ready to make the purchase as soon as you list it for the cost of the reg fees only for all the domains. Then hold them until the divorce ends. Your husband only knows someone at Ebay bought them. Ebay hides the buyers name as they have a different id then their name.
I personally don't see how that is cheating the husband. The reason I say that is although some names will sell, if they were to be sold at auction most names would not sale and the ones that did would not bring anywhere near estimated appraissal. The auction will bring back total fees spent up to that time.
Of course I am just giving a opinion here, I am certainly not a lawyer. Matter of fact I am sure they would give you a different action to do.
Transfer to their name, after divorce have them transferred back to you.
That way you do not loose all your names. Its fair as the money spent to reg them is split 50/50. No lawyers get a chunk and everyone is happy.
LOl, what a crazy idea...
OMG - how many of us could have written that? Anyone else ever hear "you'll never sell another domain", or "why are you wasting all that time on the computer" ?
Tip - keep some of the profits aside for domain renewals, even just $100 can renew over 10 domains and give you precious time.
As for domains as property value, despite no support from your husband in domaining, he's entitled to his half. Some of the arguments you use about your domains, he could say about his job and income. You could either split the portfolio in half somehow and give him possession of half the domains, or else you'll have to find a way to value the portfolio. Any domains making income can be valued on some kind of agreed 'revenue' multiple, like 12 to 60 months revenue, etc.
If you keep all the domains, then you'll have to give up an equivalent value on one of the other shared assets I would think. Good luck, I feel for you...
Lol...great thread. I am a stay-at-home dad now too after previously owning a retail business for 10 years. I have 4 kids and it's been some transition.
I would sell those domains asap before you get an injunction put on you. We spoke on PM so I won't say much more but I advise you don't place the appraisal thread. It could be used against you if fools appraise your stuff too high. If you want PM me or a select few to try and get an idea. I would be more than happy to access their value. Besides I am curious what you got since 93...
I was thinking the same thing. Don't put your domains here or in an appraisal thread. It could severely burn you later on. PM a few well-rep'd members here who have at least 30-40 transactions, so you can get an accurate (and private) idea of what they're worth...
I still think that if you have to every year renew domain registration, it's not a property. I consider it's as a service. same as you would every month pay for electricity, so it will not be shuted down, you every year pay for domain to have it. you can use you electricity just to watch tv, or you can use it to work and make some money. same with domains. so how much is your electricity worth? and is your electricity a property?..
They're not going to help on this one, believe me. They have better things to.
Do than get involved in a potential legal issue between 2 parties...
All very good points. Okay, never mind the appraisal forum. I'll be PM'ing a few folks. But before I do that, I'm wondering about another aspect of this whole domain value thing as it relates to my situation. Do you think I have a leg to stand on if I only supply the list of domains that I owned as of the date I signed the divorce papers? Or do you suppose I have to include every domain I "own" as of today, even though we have separate accounts and I've used my own money (temporary arrangement of spousal support) to purchase and renew some of them?.
Hmmm. Never realized just how many questions/issues would arise because of my domaining......
If her husband owned a business that he started from scratch, but did $1 million dollars a year in gross sales and nets $200,000, would it be fair for him to claim that the business was only worth the corporation fees he paid when he started the business? A business can also be hard to appraise and in the end is only worth what someone is willing to pay for it. If she owned poker.com would it be fair for her to claim it is only worth $10? I can't see how claiming that they are all worth reg fee is right, especially if she owns some premium domains. Her husband is entitled to half the community assets just as she is.
Wow people... I am guessing many posters here have zero knowledge of divorce law. Hiding assets or selling them in a divorce is a big no no. Though it is a domain business, any attempt to hide or defraud could be a serious infraction. Especially if you have a ruthless spouse or lawyer.. or both.
I have been though a 3 year divorce so I know fist hand exactly how it works. Your records could be sopenaed up the wazoo. IYou will be amazed what people will do for money in a divorce, I know it first hand...
I agree about the dangers that's why I said to discuss with her lawyer first. Also if she sells them that's not hiding them. Unless she has an injunction against her from selling assets she should be in the clear to sell them. Also since she may have bought many of them cheaply her selling them cheaply won't look badly. She may have a lot of stuff she paid regfee for. If on paper she sold it for $50 it's a profit and she can split the $50 with her hubby.
A $100,000 portfolio could be liquidated for $10k without appearing strange to most judges. It's legit move imho. Appraisals of domains are very iffy at best. Even better if she never has paid to get these appraised. Ignorance is bliss. The law sees that very differently.
Maybe you should read the thread again. A business would be either liquidated into cash by the courts or an assessment of it's value would need to be made and the property sorted out. The keyword there is PROPERTY which domains are NOT.
The electricity analogy is pretty close...
I'm not trying to hide assets. I know what kind of trouble that could cause, and I'm not interested in going that route.
I view my domaining as speculating in the market. I agree with labrocca that my domains are not tangible property and don't see how it could be argued any other way. Unlike a business entity that can be easily valued, domains have no intrinsic value other than what the resale marketplace will allow at any given moment. If for some reason people stopped buying and selling domains, my portfolio would be worth virtually nothing. If people are buying and selling domains like mad, then my domains will be in higher demand and will most likely bring a higher price *IF* a sale is made. If I develop a domain into a revenue-generating website, then it has a measurable value: it's revenue.
So if my domaining were considered a business, then I'm in the red and my "business" is worth nothing.
As a speculator, I'm hoping that my domains will command a high price when and if they are sold. But there is no *real* reason to expect that they will sell or ever produce a profit. Unlike a business or investments in the stock market, if my domains are worthless, I cannot take a write-off on my tax return...
Even though the domains are only worth what someone is willing to pay for them I am sure a court would make you get an appraisal from somewhere even though they arent accurate. You definitely cant say the value is regfee if the names are decent. If you owned something like poker.com then I am sure you would have to say it is worth over 1 million. There is no way to accuratley measure the value like you can with stocks but an equivalent thing would be something like someone owning a babe ruth autographed baseball card or ball. It would be worth a fortune but there is no actual market price for it to determine the value but there is no way you would get away with saying it's worth $10...
Where is a way to calculate how much money domains are making and devide this profite, if where is any. also you can separate your domains into 2 even groupps , (say each group makes same amount of money) and give your husband 1 groupp of domains. so you bouth will make same amount of money from domains. I think this is the only way to get away from paying domains approximate value to your husband...
I think everyone is missing the point that she and her stbx are handling the divorce out of court. So the real issue isn't about the legalities of whether domains are property or not, it's about the husband's percieved value of the domains. If this were going to court, I'm sure she wouldn't be on here asking our opinions, because she'd have a divorce lawyer she could ask and he would form arguments based on his knowledge and research of the law... Legally speaking, it'd probably be much easier, because you let 3rd parties argue on your behalf and then the courts make a clear, final decision. Handling it out of court is probably much harder, because she can't really argue law to her husband... They're both probably stressed out, dealing with numerous emotions and trying to deal with dividing assets in order to make it fair.
Her husband has no understanding of domains, but he's been told they are valuable, so he probably is assigning an arbitrarily high value in an effort to make sure he isn't getting screwed. Even if she gets appraisals and shows them to him, he might suspect they are not accurate and he doesn't know enough about the business to ensure that they are, so he may still percieve it as an attempt to decieve him. I personally wouldn't want to have to try to deal with someone in a "rational" manner when there is so many years of emotion and irrational feelings attached to it.
I think in the end it's just going to have to come down to reaching some form of compromise, since that seems to be the way they are approaching the matter. If she thinks they are worth $25,000 and he thinks $100,000, then they need to agree somewhere in between probably. It's not a perfect solution, but when you do things outside of the courts, theres usually some form of tradeoff...
I feel bad for you. he shouldnt be able to get any one of your domains. they are personal property imo...
And personal property aquired within a marriage is jointly owned, that is the whole problem.
I wish you the best...
If she had paid for her domains entirely with her own money, I would agree with her keeping them. However, he did in pay for them in part. If she were to sell them now, she should have to share the profits with him.
I personally suspect that if the sexes were reversed, we would not be so tolerant of someone wanting to hide marital property.
As for the domains she has acquired since the split, I can't see him having any right to them unless he funded them in some way...
DuckFOO, if you will read my posts you'll see that I have no intention of hiding marital assets. I started this thread for the purpose of getting opinions and suggestions from other domainers on how best to divide my portfolio (not that I really wanted to), but it wasn't for the purpose of figuring out how to get away with breaking the law.
To update everyone, I met with my attorney on Wednesday. Any domains I purchased on or after the date of service (when I signed the initial papers to start the divorce) are mine alone. Anything purchased prior to that (during the marriage) is considered community property. I'm in Arizona, a community property state, so this may not apply to people in other states.
So then I was still trying to come up with an efficient, equitable way to divide the domain "assets." STBX still argues that pulling a number out of his a$$ is reasonable, but that just won't fly with me.
So here's what I came up with:.
I will print out a list of all domains purchased on or before the date of service (about 3 months ago) with expiration dates and registrars. We will then flip a coin to see who chooses from the list first. STBX can bring any "expert" he likes to help him choose. We take turns choosing from the list until all of them are taken. Then we submit the split list to our attorneys to make it official.
I'm not completely happy about doing it this way because I'll probably lose some of my better domains. STBX will have to figure out what to do with the domains he gets. I don't think it's equitable or efficient for me to spend extra time selling or trying to put a $ value on the whole portfolio, so this seems to be the simplest and most equitable way to resolve the issue.
What do you guys think?..
Seeing as you have to split the domains that you purchased before signing the papers, you should try to get the highest valued ones. I think that taking turns and choosing domains should leave you with a higher valued portfolio than him, so it's not that bad. be sure to keep your personal list of the best ones somewhere safe. I think that you should also not provide him with any other appraisal facts or tools, such as traffic, ovt, etc if it's legal. good luck!!..
This scenario seems fair to me except for one thing. Why are you letting your STBX bring in a third party? Was this his idea or yours?.
Since your STBX already has a sense of the value of your portfolio (in his own mind), I'd let him choose his own domains. To be fair, you could set the meeting date ahead a few weeks to give him time to educate himself. Bringing in a third party gives him an unfair advantage IMO, unless you have that option as well.
Are you going to disclose traffic, PR, parking revenue, etc. on your list? If you don't, he may feel like he didn't get a fair deal and try to revisit the issue in the future...
I'm not concerned about him bringing in his own expert. STBX doesn't have a clue about domains, so it's only fair to let him have someone else guide him. Besides, he couldn't identify a domain expert if one bit him on the leg! I know which of my domains are most valuable, and why. I'm not planning to provide any information beyond domain name, expiration date and registrar. Hey, it's not my job to educate him...
Certainly seems like this would be an amicable.
Choice for you, but hopefully it won't all be for.
Will he be able to remember to renew them?.
Hopefully he will give you the option to maybe buy.
Them back for regfee at renewal time - if he doesn't sell.
Them first. Then again, if you really want to keep them,.
Or maybe if he chooses the "one you really wanted".
After he takes his share of domains, ask him to get an.
Apprasial (from a reliable source) and if it's not too bad.
A stretch, maybe buy them back. If he's not going to get into.
It then maybe he'll give them up. Although don't let him know which ones.
You really want.
Sounds like you guys have reached a way to keep you both content.
And that is admirable in a divorce! (mine wasn't quite so nice :bah).
Laws are good I suppose for situations that are large in scope. Lets say during the period that you were buying your domains at a price comparable to a supers sized latte.
Lets say you have $6.95 into each domain. Every time you bought a name, the parter you have spent his money on something of his choice. Then in that regard I would say your domains are so much personal property.
The law might be the law and what that law defines is up to you to agree to. But here is what I would do.
Ok, I bought this name for $6.95 , you bought that magazine. You can give me half the money spent for that magazine and so on and so on.
Any way I hope you can find a way to keep your stress level down. If it helps to know you have found a fun and exciting business to be involved in and we are pulling for you, good.
If the parasitic nature of some people is to ride the backs of the productive partner than that isn't fair. Heres my point.. did your husband have about the same amount of money to spend, but he squandered it? Lets say you went without to invest every penney into your dream business, domains.
If so I can relate as I do that myself. I don't know the situation, but what is fair is fair, every little expenditure by him is equal to the same value spent by you. If your partner wastes money (thats ok, it's theirs) what moral right would they have to lay hands on your purchases?.
Is it right then that after so much time some value is perceived in the investment by the other person?. Can it really be proper that the other party (leech) gets half?.
Yes it may be the way the law is written.
Its not something I would like to see happen to you, having a choose the biggest straw contest. Those domains are like your art. You have what you have in your head as regards their future. It is not good karma to break up that kind of bond...
Why not just split the domain list down the bottom?.
Send half to his account and half to yours. just get someone you both trust with a little knowledge in the area to split it?..
Goodkarmaco wrote: On an emotional level I agree with you. STBX and I haven't had to worry about money for years. There's always been plenty to spend on extra stuff. Instead of buying a new wardrobe every month and spending weekends at the spa, I chose to use my spending money on domains. STBX chose to buy electronics and power tools. In the end, he's getting to take all of his electronics and power tools with him, yet I have to give up (or at least split) my domains? No, it really doesn't seem fair to me.
I have a much better idea as to what domains in my portfolio are most valuable, so I do have the upper hand. I figure it's in my best interests to just let it go and move on. I can always use this as an opportunity to improve the quality of my portfolio. <glass half full> blue^ray wrote: Well, that's essentially what we'll be doing. I figure that taking turns choosing a domain from the list will be most fair.
There is one part of this solution that I haven't quite figured out though. Some domains were purchased on backorder, others were purchased from individuals. I've had some domains for a number of years and have paid renewal fees on them. Others have been paid for several years in advance. How do I figure this real-dollar-value into the split? Hmmm...
If he or yourself chooses a domain with renewals or backorders.
IE: 18-24 bucks say....
Then you get 3 at reg fee and vice versa....
If you have a list with the $value invested/paid on it to help,.
And it sounds like you have all the papers needed. So the actual $ amount.
Will be the true $ amount and not any "future worth"...
I would get an independent 3rd Party to run an excel file with all the domains in, and randomize them completely. Then just take the first one for him, the second for you, third for him, second for you. This would need to be done in front of you both and possibly a lawyer as well, or have the lawyer handle the excel calculations.
Just my 2c, Im not a legal guru or law schooled by any means...
If he is making you divide up the domains, then it's only fair he divide up the electronics and power tools. If he is keeping all of that, then you should get your domains. Seems pretty fair to me.
As far as valuation, I would value the domains at $6.95 a piece.the reg fee. He doesn't know any better, and there is no appraisal service that does anything more than guess. There is no real set of guidelines for appraising a domain like there is a house.
And domain names are not property. Have his lawyer show you where domains were legally determined as property.
Plus if he is complaining that you used communal money for the regs, well did you put your profits back into the joint account? If you did, then I would think that squares things.
But hey I am not a lawyer. If this happened to me, I would form a Corp and sell the domains to the Corp for a dollar apiece and split the profits. And then I would say, my ex wanted this liquidated and this was the best offer in the fastest timeframe. There is no hiding there, it was a liquidation at clearance prices. Domains are sold for $1-$10 all the time.
Domains are only worth what someone is willing to pay for them and I find it hard to believe he could prove in court that the domains are worth anything beyond that...
I made that point to STBX the other day and he got all pi$$y about it. He has spent so much money on power tools I couldn't begin to estimate. Certainly thousands; he always buys the very best. The $4000 TV he took with him when he moved out was only a few months old. Not to mention XM radios, Bose system, DVD player, etc. I would say these were "hobby" expenditures because he never consulted me on their purchase.
STBX refuses to go along with splitting the domains. He says he doesn't want them and that my offer to split them is just my attempt at trying to get a larger dollar amount in the settlement, which isn't the case. But of course he thinks it's reasonable to pull a number out of the air as the value on my domains and add that to my assets column. Apparently my "assets" are assets and his "assets" are not??? Kinda reminds me of "what's yours is mine and what's mine is mine." We are trying to settle these issues ourselves or in mediation, but going to court isn't out of the question. Yes, I always put domain sales money back into our joint account. I looked into doing this last spring.
Plus, I could not have any link to the corporation. Anyway, it's too late to do something like this now. True, very true!.
I don't know if I mentioned this earlier in the thread, but it turns out that any domains I obtained on or after the date of service (date I signed the acknowledgement of divorce proceedings) are off-limits to him!..
He can't have his cake and eat it too. Yes you have to split the domains/value somehow.
Yes he has to consider his "hobby" toys in the split.
He can't just apply the rules to you and not him.
Also last time I checked, getting "pi$$y" doesn't qualify as a legal method to get more than one deserves.
As you don't care about the tools or electronics (much as he could care less about owing some domains), you should put the toys in along with the domains, and begin choosing. You pick a toy/domain, he picks a toy/domain.
In the end that is either the fair way to do it, or he keeps his, and you keep yours is the fair way end of story.
In my case, I divorced very young (long ago), and it was more a division of debts, than assets.
Just my opinion of course.
And I wish you much luck, and prosperity in the future...
I wouldn't stand for it personally. He does seem to want all his stuff and then half of yours. If assets are communal property then everything gets split equally, powertools, electronics, domains... If he wants certain things and you want certain things, then you call it even and move on, that seems fair. But he seems to want everything, which doesn't seem like he is working towards an equatable solution. I know the time and money for going through the courts might seem a bit overwhelming, but in the end, you want to come out of this on equal footing and then be well equiped to move on with your life.
I'm sure you feel like you just want to put this all behind you and move on, that's a completely healthy response. You don't want to linger on the past, but at the same time, you're obviously getting divorced for a reason, so now that you are no longer together, you shouldn't allow yourself to be taken advantage of. Just doesn't seem like a good start to a new life to me. I'd be like "you keep the electronics and powertools, I keep the domains, simple as that, if you don't like it, I'll see you in court, end of story!"..
I would divide and his tools and your domains. you get half of his tools, he gets half of your domains. this would be fair to me. because if you will try to keep domains, he will think that they are valuable. flip a coin for each domain and for each tool separatelly..